The 260 market drying up? Some worrying observations.
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Thread: The 260 market drying up? Some worrying observations.

  1. #1
    #829 called 'Olive' David's Avatar
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    Default The 260 market drying up? Some worrying observations.

    You've probably noticed some turmoil in the market for ZT260's and Rover 75 V8's recently, much of which can be explained away by COVID I imagine, and to a lesser extent, fuel prices and the advent of EV's. This last 6 months the number of cars has shown an even more marked plummet however, before the Ukranian situation, and now only a handful of cars are known still to be for sale (See: Complete List of 260s FOR SALE.)

    It used to take me an hour a day, updating twice daily to keep the 'Complete List' up to date. Now that's about 10 minutes.

    At present, there are five members' cars are listed there, all MG 260s, but only one is being shown as being advertised elsewhere. Forum 'In-house' listings are fine, but generally ineffective as the sole manner of promoting sales, of course. Bit short-sighted, maybe? Excuse the pun, but also short-sited!

    Dealers are simply not listing them any more. Several dealers could be relied on to have a few in their showrooms from time to time a couple of years ago, but not any more. Are they not being offered them, or actively avoiding them even?

    OK, SMG have still got the 20-mile Rover 75 V8 of course, but outside of that, nothing.
    Summit of Dudley last sold a 260 a year ago and have had none listed since.
    Exactly the same with Beech Hill Garage, Studio Cars of Preston and Damen & Kroes in Holland.
    Elite of Borden last listed a 260 over 2 years ago.

    None of the upcoming auctions are showing any ZT 260 or R75V8, and haven't for over a year.
    CCA, SWVA, Anglia, Barons, Brightwells, Mathewsons, Historic, Bonham's 'The Market' all found wanting!
    Even Coparts can't help, by not having listed any "bent" ones at all for about 2 years!

    Other than a single Facebook Marketplace listing, on-line listings are virtually absent in the UK.
    Autotrader, eBay, Gumtree, Pistonheads haven't shown any listing for weeks and only one (member's) car is still listed, and actually for sale, on Car & Classic. Also true of the other RHD markets of Australia/NZ and S.Africa.

    On the continent of Europe it is little better. One car is listed by Mobile.de, and the same car (actually a relisted RHD R75V8) is also on AutoScout24.
    In France VIN #012 is still listed by Leboncoin, and the black Norwegian R75V8 (again) for sale from the dealer. Nothing on Reezo.de, Gaspedal.nl or eBay sites in Germany. Belgian, Scandinavian and Spanish sites, and the international "The Parking/Le Parking" have had nothing at all listed for a long time.

    ... and that's it!

    Are they simply not out their? If not, why? Have dealers decided that they are too risky to have in showrooms or on forecourts at 17 years old+ ?
    Are all our cars either dead or declared as "keepers" maybe?
    Worse still, no longer regarded as desirable or "classic"?
    With such scarcity of available cars, you would think the ones that are would be selling like 'hot-cakes', but apparently not.
    Answers on a postcard!

    David
    Last edited by David; 25-03-2022 at 06:04 PM.

  2. #2
    Registered User Dashnine's Avatar
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    I guess it depends on your point of view, as an owner or prospective buyer. As a buyer there's less to choose from, and current fuel prices won't help people decide to sell a 20mpg car but to an owner maybe it's a precursor to prices going up. If the pool of cars remains the same (the numbers of taxed and SORNed cars on HowManyLeft.co.uk should tell us that) then maybe people are hanging onto what they have with a view to the long term.

    HowManyLeft is a useful tool, but beware - it's like disappearing down a rabbit hole!
    Life's too short to drive boring cars!

    MG ZT 260 #442 in XPower Grey

  3. #3
    #829 called 'Olive' David's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dashnine View Post
    I guess it depends on your point of view, as an owner or prospective buyer. As a buyer there's less to choose from, and current fuel prices won't help people decide to sell a 20mpg car but to an owner maybe it's a precursor to prices going up...
    They should by flying off the shelves then, but they are not (yet). Selling one appears still to be a long and painful process as ever; buying one can also be much the same, with one or two "dogs" starting to pop up now!

    Five to seven years ago we had a similar 260/75V8 market here in Holland, as far as number of vehicles was concerned. I bought mine then (on the telephone) in 5 minutes, within a few hours of the listing. There was a queue of people (really) waiting when I went to pay and collect, just in case I changed my mind or wanted an instant profit. Not like that now, here or in the UK by the look of it. My 'Olive' is a keeper, until I pop my clogs!

    HowManyLeft is a useful tool, but beware - it's like disappearing down a rabbit hole!
    Loads of fake news there, I'm afraid. More Rover 75 V8 Tourers still exist than were ever made, for example.

    David
    Last edited by David; 25-03-2022 at 01:20 PM.

  4. #4
    #242 V8 on tour colintf's Avatar
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    thanks David for the insight
    cheers
    Colin
    colintf
    Colin Murrell
    vin 00242 - Probably the only 260 to have driven the full Le Mans circuit?
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  5. #5
    Registered User Dashnine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by David View Post
    They should by flying off the shelves then, but they are not (yet).
    Yes, but if the price is rising people are going to hang onto them there's no large profit to be made in a £5K - £10K car.

    Quote Originally Posted by David View Post
    Loads of fake news there, I'm afraid. More Rover 75 V8 Tourers still exist than were ever made, for example.
    Agreed (hadn't checked the Rovers TBH), and it doesn't help that the MGs are split into differently named entries, but I think the pattern still shows that cars are gradually disappearing into SORN at the same rate they're becoming unlicenced - so they're off road but not scrapped.

    I suspect the SORN cars are being tucked away until they're worth more as we're past the bottom of the depreciation curve. There's a small fluctuation in SORNs between Summer and Winter as cars come out to play in the Summer, but the trend is a gradually increasing one.

    Then you have owners who see the future appreciation for these cars and are trying to keep the miles off them and in the garage rather than using as dailies (although it's bloody hard!) with no intention of selling for as long as possible (that's me then).
    Life's too short to drive boring cars!

    MG ZT 260 #442 in XPower Grey

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    Registered User DomT101's Avatar
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    I think it’s down to a multitude of factors:

    1) The market for these cars isn’t exactly huge to start with. Only car enthusiast really know about them, the “average” car buying isn’t really aware of them.
    2) With the state of fuel prices the “average” car buying isn’t in the market for any V8 let alone these, shrinking the market further.
    3) With what’s happened over the last 2 years maybe more people are unintentionally holding onto these cars as a “collector car”. Me for example used the car as a daily 2 years ago, now it comes out once a week (maybe) and stays in the garage am I’m taking more care of it. So I’m less likely to sell and get another car and more likely to hold on to it.

    Thats my 2 pence worth anyway

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    Registered User Pete's Avatar
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    Here we go
    Have the cars always been overpriced even from new? Are we a bunch of elitists who are living in our own little bubble extolling the virtues because they are part of a "special" rare collection and we perpetuate the price tag? As times change the fickle nature becomes more fickle.
    I bought mine 6 years ago and took the view that if I still had it after 10 years it would own me nothing and would be written down to nil value. So whatever I could sell it for would be a bonus. These cars are never go to be true classics. That boat sailed some time ago.
    I love mine and drive it regularly winter/spring/summer and autumn. I love discussing it and cars in general with like minded enthusiasts at the clubs and shows.
    I used to be indecisive but now I'm not so sure.
    When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth

    2004 MG ZT 260SE Pearl Black
    1960 MGA Roadster Flame Red

  8. #8
    #829 called 'Olive' David's Avatar
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    In all fairness, Pete, the OP was about the number of cars changing hands and the decreasing "pool" of cars on the market at present.
    None of it was about prices, pricing trends or value in the more general sense, which you refer to.

    David
    Last edited by David; 25-03-2022 at 09:00 PM.

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    Administrator Tim's Avatar
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    I just see it as the ebbs and flows of demand. Yes fuel prices are high and that would have an impact. Virgin interest is fickle and dependant on publications/media/events, and numbers will always be declining to a point the car will hit a 'balance' value again. I don't think they are over valued, just based on supply and demand.
    Tim Hayton

    Some men see things as they are and say why - I dream things that never were and say why not.

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    Registered User SCP440's Avatar
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    Could part of the reason the present owners don't have any reason to sell them?

    I for one have no intention of selling mine if for no other reason what would I replace it with? Everything manufacturerd in the last 15 years is either eye Wateringly expensive to buy and or maintain or dull as dishwater.

    I love the idea of some of the Merc and BMW's but have you seen what it costs to keep them on the road?

    Steve

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