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torque2me
19-10-2010, 06:11 AM
Hi all,

Have a real issue trying to get into and out of gear.

Possible causes are:-

1. Gearbox
1a. Bent selection fork
1b. Weak synchro

2. Clutch
2a. Warped clutch

3. Clutch hydraulics ( I take it they are fitted?)


Symptoms:-

(a) If engine is started in neutral then it is impossible to select ANY gear. Once engine/gearbox are warm (gearbox oil) then it is possible to select upwards if done slowly but it is very notchy. Impossible to change down unless at a virtual stop and, again, it improves when gearbox oil is warm but first gear remains virtually impossible unless many, many oaths have been issued over a great period of time.

I have to start in-gear. I press the clutch down - which should give a neutral state - but the car will move as the clutch (for whatever reason) is not freed. It is not possible to take it out of gear unless the engine is switched off.

(b) Clutch pedal travel is poor - my guess is it only starts to become effective over the last inch or so.


My feeling is hydraulics with warped clutch second as these symptoms started at only 20k miles. Is the vehicle fitted with a master and slave?

I read that Dreadnought had fitted a ZF box. Does anyone know the model/type? Did they fit clutch uprated facing material or left the original in?

Any ideas or thoughts gratefully received as I would prefer to replace the part causing the problem rather than renew all three.


regards,

Kev

tom_2084
19-10-2010, 08:24 AM
Hi mate

Sounds to me like a clutch issue
Yes we do have hydralic master and slave cyclinders on our car for the clutch

I've had simular issues sounds to me like a leaking master cyclinder which is under the dash with the pedals. if you put your hand down around that area you may find bit of oil around there.

I could be wrong tho best get checked out by a garage

Fishy
19-10-2010, 07:09 PM
Hello Kev,

Does this improve if you pump the clutch pedal a few times - before trying to select the gear?

Regards,
Fishy

colintf
19-10-2010, 07:45 PM
hope its sorted soon Kev.

Where in the world are you??????

:cool:

Keith
19-10-2010, 08:34 PM
First thing to do is get under the car and see if you are losing fluid around the bell housing

Then try to bleed the system.

I would then concentrate on ensuring the master is ok first because getting at the slave is a bit more complex.

get yourself signed up and on to the full forum, several tips to be read about master cylinders

re-tread
20-10-2010, 02:10 AM
Have a read of this thread Kev.

https://www.two-sixties.co.uk/mgoc260/html/f0rum/showthread.php?t=6336

torque2me
20-10-2010, 04:02 AM
Hi mate

Sounds to me like a clutch issue
Yes we do have hydralic master and slave cyclinders on our car for the clutch

I've had simular issues sounds to me like a leaking master cyclinder which is under the dash with the pedals. if you put your hand down around that area you may find bit of oil around there.

I could be wrong tho best get checked out by a garage


I'm leaning that way, very long, soft travel.

torque2me
20-10-2010, 04:04 AM
Hello Kev,

Does this improve if you pump the clutch pedal a few times - before trying to select the gear?

Regards,
Fishy


Fishy,

No, the clutch pedal has a long, soft travel and appears not to have any real effect.

cheers,

Kev

torque2me
20-10-2010, 04:07 AM
First thing to do is get under the car and see if you are losing fluid around the bell housing

Then try to bleed the system.

I would then concentrate on ensuring the master is ok first because getting at the slave is a bit more complex.

get yourself signed up and on to the full forum, several tips to be read about master cylinders
Keith,

Had the vehicle on a four poster a couple of weeks ago. No sign of any fluids on the bell housing. Will have to drop the box if nothing found in any other areas of search.

cheers,

Kev

torque2me
20-10-2010, 04:10 AM
hope its sorted soon Kev.

Where in the world are you??????

:cool:
Colin,

Located Hatfield, Herts. I don't know of any like owners and I'm unsure if there was any difference to the front wheel drive set-up.


cheers,

Kev

mikpeirce
20-10-2010, 09:39 AM
Colin,

Located Hatfield, Herts. I don't know of any like owners and I'm unsure if there was any difference to the front wheel drive set-up.


cheers,

Kev

Hi Kev,

Same town as me. I take it yours is the silver saloon with x-power back boxes. :D

There is a clutch bleed nipple in the pipe beside the bell housing, which I have bled mine with, although it was so tight I had to securley hold the pipe and had to be extremely carefull when loosening the bleed nipple.

It is a 2 man job to bleed this pipe as you'll need to lift the pedal back up after depressing to bleed. Also make sure you have the clutch master cylinder cap securely tightened when carrying out the bleeding as otherwise when depressing the pedal you'll just launch the fluid straight out of the top of the master cylinder.

When finished, if you have cruise control, you'll need to reset the clutch pedal cruise switch, which is on a ratchet and needs pulling back into contact with the clutch pedal once it has found it's natural height.

2V8s
20-10-2010, 10:33 AM
hi,

yes does sound like hydraulics - read through the thread that re-tread posted. I got mine sorted in the end with a couple of new seals for the master cylinder (about £15 all in from BMW).

If its the master cyclinder, then you will be able to see/feel fluid most likely around the bottom of the cylinder where the pipe from the bulkhead connects to.

I hope for your sake it is this end because if its the slave cylinder then this is an engine out job to get to!.

But also check the bleed nipple as others have mentioned (behind passenger road wheel under car) and also, do check you have fluid in the reservoir! if its too low then air could have gotten in.

Usually, pumping the clutch would be likely to help a little in the interim? biut once it completely goes, as mine did, then you cant change gear at all.

Be warned - once the problem has been found and resolved, bleeding the system is not easy and takes time, patience and sticking to method.

torque2me
21-10-2010, 05:16 AM
Have a read of this thread Kev.

https://www.two-sixties.co.uk/mgoc260/html/f0rum/showthread.php?t=6336
Re-tread,

Am not able at the present time to view this. Could you perhaps e-mail me with the contents in text form?


regards,

Kev

AndyG
21-10-2010, 12:12 PM
Re-tread,

Am not able at the present time to view this. Could you perhaps e-mail me with the contents in text form?


regards,

Kev

It's 3 pages long. :)

When are you going green?? then you will be open to a world of info.

What area do you live??

torque2me
22-10-2010, 05:12 AM
It's 3 pages long. :)

When are you going green?? then you will be open to a world of info.

What area do you live??


GReeen? I've bought huge numbers of wind turbines and such crap that I don't have enough pennies to sort this out quickly ;-) Seriously though, due to corporate policy it is considered good form to not only be present for a set number of hours, but to ACTUALLY work those hours. Even more seriously, my computer system will only except pure text and rubbish such as Micro$oft's Word (and their text editor) imbeds garbage which rings alarm bells on the old virus checker, which results in a big boot into the bin. I will need to save the form onto some flash drive (probably have to hide it in an orifice to get it past security) and send to Tim when appropiately rendered.

Yours exhausted,

Kev

torque2me
22-10-2010, 05:18 AM
Hi Kev,

Same town as me. I take it yours is the silver saloon with x-power back boxes. :D

There is a clutch bleed nipple in the pipe beside the bell housing, which I have bled mine with, although it was so tight I had to securley hold the pipe and had to be extremely carefull when loosening the bleed nipple.

It is a 2 man job to bleed this pipe as you'll need to lift the pedal back up after depressing to bleed. Also make sure you have the clutch master cylinder cap securely tightened when carrying out the bleeding as otherwise when depressing the pedal you'll just launch the fluid straight out of the top of the master cylinder.

When finished, if you have cruise control, you'll need to reset the clutch pedal cruise switch, which is on a ratchet and needs pulling back into contact with the clutch pedal once it has found it's natural height.


X-power Gray. Don't know if the boxes have been changed - I always thougth they were the originals :-/

Do you know off-hand if the fluid is silicon or DOT4 (+)?

torque2me
22-10-2010, 05:38 AM
hi,

yes does sound like hydraulics - read through the thread that re-tread posted. I got mine sorted in the end with a couple of new seals for the master cylinder (about £15 all in from BMW).

If its the master cyclinder, then you will be able to see/feel fluid most likely around the bottom of the cylinder where the pipe from the bulkhead connects to.

I hope for your sake it is this end because if its the slave cylinder then this is an engine out job to get to!.

But also check the bleed nipple as others have mentioned (behind passenger road wheel under car) and also, do check you have fluid in the reservoir! if its too low then air could have gotten in.

Usually, pumping the clutch would be likely to help a little in the interim? biut once it completely goes, as mine did, then you cant change gear at all.

Be warned - once the problem has been found and resolved, bleeding the system is not easy and takes time, patience and sticking to method.
I'll do a thorough check when time permits but I'm used to seeing master on the bulkhead and slave on the side of the gearbox - a quick look in the engine bay of a ZT-260 doesn't give much away.

Do you have any part numbers for the BMW seal kits (not the seals that swim and eat fish).


regards,

Kev

ColinE
22-10-2010, 09:56 AM
Brake fluid is DOT4 not silicone

If you complete the questionnaire Tim sent you on registering you'll go green and get access to a wealth of information

torque2me
14-03-2011, 05:59 PM
Hi mate

Sounds to me like a clutch issue
Yes we do have hydralic master and slave cyclinders on our car for the clutch

I've had simular issues sounds to me like a leaking master cyclinder which is under the dash with the pedals. if you put your hand down around that area you may find bit of oil around there.

I could be wrong tho best get checked out by a garage


Tom,

A bleed did the trick. Now my cruise is not working but I don't know when it failed. Perhaps it has never worked from new - I have never had the need to use the unnnecessary accessory.


regards,


Kev

AndyG
14-03-2011, 06:00 PM
Tom,

A bleed did the trick. Now my cruise is not working but I don't know when it failed. Perhaps it has never worked from new - I have never had the need to use the unnnecessary accessory.
regards,

Kev

Check the switches on the clutch and brake pedals.

;)

Coasting
14-03-2011, 06:02 PM
I have never had the need to use the unnnecessary accessory.


regards,


Kev

So why do you want to use it now? :p

torque2me
14-03-2011, 06:11 PM
Hi Kev,

Same town as me. I take it yours is the silver saloon with x-power back boxes. :D

There is a clutch bleed nipple in the pipe beside the bell housing, which I have bled mine with, although it was so tight I had to securley hold the pipe and had to be extremely carefull when loosening the bleed nipple.

It is a 2 man job to bleed this pipe as you'll need to lift the pedal back up after depressing to bleed. Also make sure you have the clutch master cylinder cap securely tightened when carrying out the bleeding as otherwise when depressing the pedal you'll just launch the fluid straight out of the top of the master cylinder.

When finished, if you have cruise control, you'll need to reset the clutch pedal cruise switch, which is on a ratchet and needs pulling back into contact with the clutch pedal once it has found it's natural height.


Mike,

Clutch slave bled when car was taken to the body shop. I've got the car back and then had a service at Brown & Gammons. I mentioned that the cruise was not setting. Collecting the car they mentioned that they though it was caused by "the switch-stop/cruise brake" part (number XKD000010) which is a double pole switch in white.

The part is NLA (suprise, suprise). However, before I vent my fury at CAT it might be that B & G has not understood how to re-set the switch after a bleed. I've not been able to fully understand your previous reponse regarding the re-setting and probly will not until I get to see said switch in situ. Could you perhaps provide assistance in the form of a chat?


regards,


Kev

mikpeirce
14-03-2011, 11:45 PM
Could you perhaps provide assistance in the form of a chat?


No problem Kevin, mobile number sent by PM.

Mik

torque2me
16-03-2011, 05:19 AM
So why do you want to use it now? :p

Cause SE spec includes it and when selling on some people actually go for the whistles and bells and thus will be wanting me to fix it before parting with a lowly amount of readies :-)


cheers,

Kev

Coasting
16-03-2011, 09:40 AM
OIC you are selling yours?

Whats the details on yours? Any pictures?

Sounds like you have got fed up with the ZT now...